All right as much as I don't wanna do this, a hearty congratulations to Mike Schneider- ... and his team, the Arsenal Gunners, who have won the Premier League. Congratulations, Mike. Fantastic. Yeah. Thanks, Ray. You had a good weekend? I've been having good week after good week. It technically- It's been a fantastic season.
Technically it was about two weeks ago that they clinched it. I know, but- But it was last weekend they raised the trophy ... it's just been a lot of fun. Yeah. It's been a lot of fun. I've never, ever regretted- Yeah ... being an Arsenal supporter. Have you been a supporter since they've won the last one, or no? Yeah.
22 years ago. I was. Okay. I was a supporter 22 years ago. Okay. Since 1997. Sigh indeed. Yeah. I love that your stupid club wins and- ... this is the one day you choose to wear literally zero Arsenal stuff. That is interesting. That is really weird. Yeah. I would have thought he'd show up with a tattoo on his face.
You don't wanna... do you not wanna gloat? The Gunner cannon tattooed to his forehead. No, I was supposed to have jury duty today. I was thinking more like a little Arteta as the baby Jesus. Okay. But anyway. Mikel Arteta is the manager of Arsenal, so yeah. I was gonna say he's the only player I know on the team.
I'm kidding. He's the manager, right? I know who he is. I know who he is. I'm kidding. I was. I was gonna get the cannon across my forehead, but Arteta Jesus is coming instead. Yeah. Okay. Okay. There is a bar in New York City that is the Arsenal bar. Oh, Hanlan's. It's called... Oh, Hanlan's. Yeah. Yes maybe when we're in New York in a couple weeks- You'll be able to celebrate the Premier League and perhaps even the Champions League, which the final is happening, Oh, man.
How great would that be? ... this weekend. Yeah. We'll be in New York City, of course, in a couple weeks for BevNET Live in New York City 2026. He's such a pro. I don't know about that. But anyway- ... June 10th and 11th, that's when it's happening. It is the event for the beverage industry, investors, retailers, distributors, consultants, designers, suppliers, service providers.
They're all gonna be at BevNET Live, and you wanna be there as well. You also get a chance to meet your heroes, like Olivia Faraday, Daniel Cory. The Trip team will be there. Yeah. They're gonna be on stage. They're gonna give you, lessons of how they built their brand. They'll tell you a lot about their playbook, but you can just walk up to them, have a conversation.
Tell them where you are in your journey. They're gonna give you advice. Yeah, Mark Rampolla, the founder of Zico, Tom First, one of the co-founders of Nantucket Nectars and current founder- ... of Culture Pop. I mean- NBD. Yeah, NBD. Tom First. This is like an everyday thing. We mentioned this last week, Bill Shufelt from Athletic Brewing.
Oh, my gosh. But yeah I think it's a win-win for anyone who attends. Again, you're gonna meet and interact with the founders of some of the most cutting-edge brands in the industry, and the founders of those brands will have an opportunity to meet, as you mentioned, their heroes and folks who can help them scale their businesses.
And retailers, distributors- And retail- of course, yes ... investors. We'll have two retailers on stage as judges for the New Beverage Showdown, one from the Vitamin Shoppe and one from Whole Foods. Awesome. To find out who those folks are gonna be, head to bevnetlive.com and register. I'm pretty sure you will as soon as you see those names.
Speaking of great retailers that are taking one-to-ones, do you know we have Wegmans and Walmart? The Ws? The Ws. The Ws. I love that. Two big Ws. Big Ws for us. Big Ws for you. I am excited for that because, as everyone knows, I'm a big Wegmans fan, and I've gotten into Walmart lately as well. Walmart's fantastic.
Lot, lot of delivery from Walmart of late, yeah. It's fantastic. Yeah. They have good blue shirts there. They have a lot of good blue shirts there. They do, actually. The stuff I order is- that one you're wearing looks kinda, kinda Walmart grade. I don't know if that's Walmart, I'm totally kidding.
This is Versace, okay? That's what I said, I was complimenting Walmart. You said it was Walmart grade. No, that's good. What part of Versace is not Versace? Do you not understand? They were chop- What do they, they don't chop the prices. What do they do at Walmart? I don't know what they do. Those old commercials.
That's a, that's, it's an old commercial they refer to, yeah. Yeah they roll them back. Roll them back. A roll back. They roll back the prices. Yeah. They roll them back with the smiley face. That's what they used to do anyway. That's right. Once again, June 10th and 11th in New York City.
Do not miss it, bevnetlive.com. I was hoping we'd see Lionel Messi on stage at BevNet Live at some point. I don't know if that's gonna happen. Lionel Messi, obviously the very famous footballer from Argentina. Very famous. Also with Inter Miami, but best known for his days at Barcelona. This was your chance to use the word most.
Well- He's like the world's most famous human. Even I know who he is. I would say Ronaldo's probably more famous than he is. Come on. He is. He's not. He is. He's not. Okay, anyway. He is. They're probably equal. Just getting dumber. They're equal. They're equal.
Okay, equally famous. So I mention this because Lionel Messi is one of the founders of a brand called Más+ by Messi, which was a sports drink that splashed onto the scene in 2024. It was co-launched by Marc Anthony Brands. Marc Anthony Brands, John Craven is most famous for? White Claw. White Claw, exactly.
And it seemed like this was going- 1,000 points. This was going to be the next challenger brand in the sports drink category. But unfortunately, it's off the pitch. It's done. Well done, Ricky. Yeah. You like that? He's so good. Yeah. You like that? He's so good. Yeah, last week the CEO of the Marc Anthony group confirmed to BevNet that the co-venture had concluded at the start of the year, which makes me wonder how difficult it is to break through in the sports drink category when you've got a great strategic investor- and partner like Marc Anthony Brands. When you've got, I'm assuming, a lot of money behind this company. And of course, Mike would argue, the most famous athlete in the world One of, if not the most famous people in the world. Yeah. Yeah. According to the article written by our very own Marty Caballero, Mas+ by Messi had struggled to gain a foothold in the sports drink category for its core 16.9 ounce PET line since launching in March of 2024.
Even though it checked all the boxes for low sugar, low calorie, and electrolytes, and built out of a beer line DSD house, the brand had aimed to wave the popularity that has surrounded the superstar, that being Messi, since his arrival in the US and Major League Soccer. But John Craven, you've tried this brand.
You've seen it. You've followed this brand. Yeah, I thought it was pretty good for what it is. I mean- That was the qualified yeah and look, sports drinks are not trying to be the maybe most delicious beverage you'll ever have. They're a functional product, and I think maybe in hindsight what seemed like good timing for this actually wasn't.
And yeah, the sports drink category is like incredibly hard. I think what we saw happen with Prime in the past two years or whatever, I don't know, I wonder if this is part of the cycle where consumers aren't super high on just straight up sports drinks, I also wonder if just putting his name on the bottle and on the brand wasn't enough.
I didn't feel like you saw Messi promoting this brand as much as you saw, say, Jake Paul promoting Prime. Logan Paul. Oh, Logan Paul. Okay. KS1, but your point is taken. I was gonna say the same thing, which is that we hardly ever saw Messi's face anywhere near Mas+. And yeah, the name Messi's on there, and of course people can read, but still, was he behind it enough?
And also, we saw what happened with Prime as you me- you both mentioned Prime. Mas+ seemed like an analog for Prime, which had its up and then it just kinda fell off a cliff too. So there was like a romantic period for sports drinks again, and then there wasn't suddenly. There was that infamous photo of Messi drinking out of a bottle, quote unquote, drinking out of a bottle of Mas+ that was on the cover of BevNet Magazine.
And it looked like the entire opening of the bottle was in his mouth. It was seemingly very photoshopped. And if your star- Yeah ... and the person who the brand is essentially named after is faking drinking a bottle of his own product, It's a bad look ... that's not the best look. Not the best look.
No, not the best look. Never really saw any reels of him or, it wasn't on the sidelines near him or any of that sort of thing that would make it seem a lot more authentic. I think this also speaks to the importance of the founder being the face of, and not always the face of, but being deeply involved with the brand.
For some brands it works really well, some brands it's not necessarily the most important part of scaling. But it seems like brands these days That have a founder front and center have a deeper connection with consumers than otherwise. I'm seeing that a lot with early stage brands. You always hear about how modern consumers wanna hear about who's behind the products that they're eating or drinking, and their story as well.
Is it a key to their success? Is it a key to scaling? Perhaps not, but it seems to help. And I, again I think the authentic connection between Messi and this brand just wasn't there. For sure. Yeah. And it just shows that a celebrity alone is not a strategy. The celebrity has to be involved, there has to be a story arc, there has to be more to it than just a celebrity endorsed it.
Yeah. And with all the success that Prime had, there were shortages in stores, people couldn't get ahold of it, Logan Paul was associated with it. All of the work that they put into building that brand ultimately didn't wind up as a success, so if Más by Messi didn't necessarily achieve all of those goals, then I don't know, what does it say about the category of sports drinks in general?
Prime's gotta be kicking themselves though, because they had that Arsenal sponsorship then- this is an interest- Until this year. Yeah. This is an interesting segue because I spoke this week with Chris Kirby, who is the founder of Ithica Hummus, and also one of the co-founders of Guillermo's Salsa, Guillermo being the famous Guillermo from the Jimmy Kimmel show.
And I asked Chris about Scaling the brand and how far a celebrity can take a brand, especially at the outset. And he talked about the importance of having that advantage and having that name brand recognition to at least get the word out- ... to help spur excitement and awareness about what they're doing.
How far and how deeply and how much of the scaling is going to be tied to Guillermo's celebrity in the future is an important question. But no matter what, he's applying, Chris that is applying the lessons he learned with developing and building Ithaca Hummus and applying them to Guillermo's Salsa, which, both brands are in line with his expertise, both are refrigerated brands in essentially the same part of the store.
It's an excellent listen. Again, Chris is a really bright guy, talks a lot about the importance of fundamentals. He has some really interesting opinions about fundraising. So if you have an opportunity, tune in. I don't know why you wouldn't have an opportunity. You- you got half an hour. Tune into this week's episode with Chris Kirby.
It is titled The Simple and Reliable Secret Behind Ithaca's Success and Guillermo's Hot Start. They s- they sold $3 million worth of product already for Guillermo's? 'Cause it's- ... good stuff, would you have bought it if it wasn't Guillermo, if you didn't know it was the- first of all, I did, 'cause I'm pretty sure it's the same thing as Ithaca Salsa, which was great.
But, Yeah ... no, look, I think all the stuff, the messy thing, Guillermo's, the celebrity, it gets you in the door, it gets you the trial buy, but it doesn't get you the repeat buy. And if the product can't stand on its own or execution isn't good, no amount of more celebrity's gonna make you buy the thing again, so you're saying you need a Chris Kirby like object to make sure that the operation is there? Sure. You n- again you just gotta have a product that, "Fine, I'm gonna try this 'cause Guillermo's cool," but is the salsa actually good? Will I buy it again? And fortunately it is, so yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's a refrigerated, high pressure processed salsa that has great flavor, feels like it is very fresh tasting.
And yes, Guillermo's will excite you. If you try it in store, you'll go, "Yeah, I'll give this a shot." And then you might actually forget or don't even care about the Guillermo's part because the salsa is so good. But it also takes more than Chris Kirby on your team too. You need to have an entire team of quality folks who understand how a market works, how to operate, how to build great marketing, how to get it into the stores, how to pitch to retailers.
There's so much that goes into building a product. Again, celebrity just isn't enough. That's a good point, Mike, and that's also part of the interview that I did with Chris. Was him talking about the relationship that he has had with his co-packer for many years, and how important that relationship is It was so important that they called their original hummus Cold Crafted- Yes
after the process that they developed together. Yeah. And also, again, having a great team. When Chris came into the office for our interview, he brought with him the president of Guillermo's Salsa, Leo. Who's a great guy, definitely seems to know what he's doing, and it's a dream team when you have- a guy like Leo, when you have Chris, and you have Guillermo's, and certainly that brand's gonna go far. Yeah, it's a product that doesn't have a lot of competition. I can't think of any other fresh salsas that I buy on a regular basis, so I'm excited to see what happens. There are plenty of brands. Not one that I buy over...
i've tried a few different brands, but I feel like there isn't one that I've tried that I go back to. Isn't there one called Willy's that's pretty, pretty great? There's a few in there there, there is definitely a category, so that's good. Yeah, there's, I might be mispronouncing this.
This Jalapa or Jalapa. That's a... It comes in a glass jar. Beautiful looking package. Very nice packaging. Yeah, I saw that for the first time in Austin, and now I believe they have national distribution, perhaps in Whole Foods. Don't quote me on that. Think so. Yeah, great looking brand. Lots of great looking brands on our tables, and I wanna get to a few of them, including a- Oh, God.
Our first F- Don't open that one. Here. Open this one. Yeah, don't do it. Yeah. You need more colostrum. Okay. I apologize, listeners, for screaming in your ear. Yeah. Don't forget what your, happened to your ancestors last week. Oh. Oh, hold on. All you have to do is ti- tip the top. Okay.
Don't. I'm not gonna open it yet. Don't. Okay, this is a can of soda that is in front of John, Mike, and Melissa. I don't have one. I'm holding it in my hand. I can't pronounce the name of the brand, but I see that it's a- Armra ... colostrum soda. That's right. I thought it was Armada. I thought it was Armada too.
Yeah, Armra. Armra. Armra. How is it spelled? A-R-M, backwards R-A. Armra. I saw this in our beverage cooler, and I was immediately drawn, of course, to colostrum soda. If we're, like, highlighting ingredients here, last time it was buzz button flower. This time it's colostrum. Can we just... I'm sorry to interrupt one sec.
In the flavor of huckleberry. I'm always confused by this. Okay. What is colostrum? So colostrum is the, It's also known as liquid gold, but it's a dairy product produced by mammals in the first up to 72 hours after giving birth that supposedly is filled with nutrients and everything you need to start life.
So this is grass-fed colostrum, and who knows? Maybe if you drink it when you're in your 40s, it's just as good as when you're 72 hours old. I don't know. I don't know either. Let's find out. I'm down. And these guys have been around for a while. They have a pretty successful supplement business of this stuff sold in powder form, when I first saw all of the functional benefits on the side of the can, they say immunity, gut, skin, hair, and vitality, I was expecting to look at the ingredient list and see four or five functional ingredients that all do these things, but from what I see here, it really is mostly the colostrum.
So their value proposition is that colostrum can support all of those functions. I think it's an ingredient that has, I wouldn't say at this point mainstream awareness, but it feels like one that has been slowly building. It's got 15 calories of almost candy flavor. It's pretty tasty. I know there are people that are looking for- consumer brands that are going to support their own gut health.
And it certainly seems to be a function that is on the rise. I just wonder if they're gonna be reaching for this. And Melissa, you have some thoughts on this as well, 'cause, gut health has been top of mind for you for 20 years now. Pretty much forever, yeah. And also on nonbase.com, if you head over to our data hub, there is a report by Spate that just came out recently on functional gut health drinks.
There's some really interesting stuff in there talking about prebiotic, probiotic, postbiotics, what consumers are looking for, the symptoms that they're looking to solve for. So things like bloating, acid reflux, some of the top ingredients that consumers are looking for in order to treat those symptoms.
They also, of course, talked about fiber. And what I got from that report is that people are still trying to understand fiber in general. Craven, you've made the point that protein is really easy for people to understand, but- Relatively. Yeah. To fiber. Yeah. Yeah, but fiber is more complicated, so there are some really interesting findings in there about what consumers understand and what they don't understand, and they also listed some of the top brands by popularity.
Wild Wonder was in there, of course. So definitely interesting. Head over to nonbase.com to find out all about what's new and current with gut health drinks. Wanna call out a couple brands that were highlighted on Nosh recently, including Khloud Foods. Khloud, K-H-L-O-U-D, founded by Khloé Kardashian and helmed...
he's also a co-founder, excuse me, by Jeff Rubenstein as well. Just raised $15 million according to a Form D filed with the SEC. Read all about it on nosh.com. Lucas Southard, our dear colleague, wrote all about it. And then Wilde, W-I-L-D-E, which is a maker of protein snacks. They're best known for their chicken chips.
They don't market them as chicken chips. They market them as protein chips, but these are chips that are literally made out of chicken breast. And they recently introduced a new line of protein crackers. I sat down with founder and CEO Jason Wright recently for an interview that'll appear in a future episode of Taste Radio, and I have in my hand a package of these protein crackers.
They contain 12 grams of protein per serving. They're baked, according to the package, with real chicken breast, chicken bone broth, and cheddar cheese. Now- Hold on, John. They come in this beautiful- I'm gonna fight you. I'm gonna fight you for this. I wanna try. I wanna try 'em. Yeah, me too. They come in this beautiful pouch, 7.4 ounces.
They have a smaller one as well. If you were to look at this package, I don't wanna use the brand name, but it is what it is. You would look at this and say, "This is a protein Cheez-It. This is a chicken Cheez-It," 'cause it looks exactly like that. Does it taste like that, John Craven? He's gonna open the bag.
I hope not. We're gonna find out. I hope it tastes like Wild. Meanwhile, Wild is opening or has opened a new facility to fuel their broader snack ambitions. That's according to a title for an article penned by Monica Watrus. This is also something that Jason and I get into in our interview. So tune in soon.
But if you wanna read the story about Wild, its new facility, and the launch of these protein crackers, you can check out Monica's story. But we're gonna give you the, You were right, ... we're gonna give you the- You want the instant review? ... the instant review here on Taste Radio. What's up, John? What do you think?
Really tasty. They are very good. I had some over the weekend, and they're excellent. The cracker is really tasty. It's like a cracker within a cracker. Tastes like a sour cracker. Super crispy. I'm so surprised. I've had their chips, and I think they're fine, but I would- I love them. This is way more appealing.
To me, this is way more appealing. I'd like to taste some of their other flavors in cracker form, like some of the chicken chip flavors that they have, like the spicy ones in particular, in cracker form. These are great. Has anyone ever had a chicken in a biscuit cracker? Chicken in a biscuit cracker.
Oh, you know what? This actually came up in a conversation that I had on Friday. That's apparently a cult thing in the Pacific Northwest, right? Oh, I don't know. I had a college roommate that was, like, addicted to them many years ago. They still exist. They're chicken flavored- Yes ... or is there chicken in them?
It's a chicken flavored cracker. That's so funny you bring that up. And it weirdly, there's a weird flavor to this that reminds me of that. But these are way higher quality. I feel like it has just the Wild essence in it, but it does taste like a Cheez-It. I'm sure that's what they were going for.
Yeah. Yeah, they're a little bit more brittle than a Cheez-It, but I think that- Brittle? Crunchy. Crunchy, yeah. The crunch is there, for sure. Yeah, but they're so reminiscent of them- Yeah. ... That I think, what a win. I am not a fan of Cheez-Its, so I yield to you on that. I like these. You don't like Cheez-Its?
No, I just don't like... I don't really Cheez-Its. They taste like chemicals, but- Yeah ... yeah. These don't though They are chemicals the point of reference on this is amazing because on the front of pack, the biggest thing enlarged obviously, is one of the protein crackers, and it looks exactly like a Cheez-It.
So if you're looking for a Cheez-It alternative that has a lot of protein, better for you, then you taste it and you It's essentially the real thing. It is a Cheez-It you can see from space. Yes, it's huge, yeah. Does it say sourdough culture on the side of that bag? It does, on the back as well, yes. That makes a lot of sense.
Pretty sourdough. Yeah, it does. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's tasty. Hold on, I gotta... i'm not gonna throw this across the room- Okay. All right ... when there's open microphones. All right. All right. All right. While I'm sealing this up and tossing it to Mike, John's got a box of something in his hand. What is that?
Summer Camp. Summer Camp. Yeah. Despite coming in a box that I would describe is more commonly used for I don't know- Mac and cheese ... mac and cheese. Yes. Summer Camp is a, hydration product. It's stick packs of iced tea. That's adorable. Stick packs of liquid, I assume concentrate, right? Is it liquid?
Yeah. Oh, it's not stick. It's liquid. Okay, I thought it was powder. Liquid mixes a lot better than powder, generally speaking. So I don't know, I'm kinda curious to try this. It's to make craft iced tea. Maybe it's craft in a verb sense. I don't know what they're going for- It says craft iced tea, made easy
but it's 20 calories, it's got sugar, stevia. Pretty cool looking package. Definitely kinda cuts through the clutter, merchandising might be slightly difficult, unless that's a D to C play. Let's put it right next to Auntie Anne's. We've got, Auntie Anne's? ... lemon, lemon yuzu jasmine green tea, peach black tea, and mango oolong tea.
Yeah. But as you pointed out, the package kinda looks like a mac and cheese package. Takes up a lot of space on shelf. I'm wondering how that's gonna fit. I don't know if it looks like a mac and cheese package. The shape is mac and cheese package. It's yellow. Everything is a yellow or shade of yellow, except for one.
Or pink. One of, one is- Except for the pink one ... one's a pink one. Yeah. It looks like the fruits from Ugly got a new job too. Nice. Well done. The old Ugly seltzers. Okay. I don't know how we went from... Maybe it's my fault. We went from wild protein crackers to Summer Camp. Which, to be fair, I'm not hating on Summer Camp.
I actually, I think that's a really cool brand. I'm just wondering about mer- It's pretty cool. Innovative packaging ... I'm just wondering about merchandising. But we totally skipped- Protein chips. We have got some protein chips and puffs that Melissa brought here. This is Rogue? We've got Rogue snacks here.
Rogue snacks actually just raised $2.5 million this month. They have this line of protein snacks that also have probiotics, and I was interested to see with the wild- They're just pro snacks? I was interested to see the sourdough culture in the wild snacks. I don't know if that contributes any sort of probiotic to those, but these pair high protein with probiotics.
They are launching these in Walmart, like we were just talking about, in 2,800 stores in July. I don't notice a lot of seed oil free certifications. I see it being called out on packages, but that's not a certification that I've seen on a lot of products recently, so I thought that was interesting.
But these were developed by Science Inc., which was also the organization that was responsible for incubating and investing in Liquid Death. They come in some pretty interesting packaging. It looks like a half a Pringles- Yeah. ... a container. I swear I thought there might be- Half pint
one of those that's in a hotel room and costs $15. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. I thought when I opened those that there were going to be Pringles inside, and the interesting thing about that snack is that they each have their own unique shape. There's not one shape across the containers. Yeah. They talk about these having a high amount of flavor, like intense flavor.
I didn't notice that necessarily with the churro, but I did notice that with the spicy chicken sandwich SKU, which Ray has in his hand. Yeah. Even though they come in packaging that is reminiscent of Pringles, the chips aren't really chips per se. They're puffs. Yeah, those aren't really chips. Yeah they're puffy.
But those are puffs. Yeah, I'm sure those are puffs. Yeah. The churros are puffs. Exactly. S- but interesting flavors. Spicy chicken sandwich is one that I don't recall seeing before, and churro is always a great flavor. So yeah, these look like... I can definitely see these playing in Walmart. There's also one that's Cheerio shaped too, the...
It's chocolate chip cookie or something. Oh, chocolate chip cookie dough I think. Yeah, chocolate chip cookie dough. Yeah. And it's shaped like little Cheerios. Nice. Nice. I think I would like the puffs to be all the same puff across SKUs. See, that's one of the things about this that's really interesting is that- The packaging is pretty similar across the SKUs.
And you can tell it's Rogue, and you can tell that you're gonna get some of the same benefits from each of them, but the shapes are all pretty different. So in theory, you could make a you could make like a Chex Mix with- A Chex Mix. You could make a- ... chicken churro, ... chocolate chip cookie dough.
Chex Mix. Oh, no. Let's try it later, Melissa. How about some Chili Crisp flavored chips? That would be really good. Holy chili. Yeah, Mike's got some Holy Chili- Holy chili ... which is spelled Holy, H-O-L-Y, T-S-H-I-L-I. Yep. Holy Chili. And they come in the classic jar that Chili Crisp is known for. Yeah. These are a lot more oil-forward than some of the others that are out there, so this one's pretty cool.
We've got spicy everything Chili Crisp, then we've also got extra spicy everything Chili Crisp, both of them with a scorpion on the logo so that- ... they're letting you know that it's seriously spicy. And then we've got some spicy everything furikake seasoning as well. Pretty excited to try this.
You can pour it on pizza, ramen, rice, eggs, dumplings, soups, noods it says ice cream, spuds, on Tottenham, and everything that needs spicy, crispy love. Tottenham definitely needs. Here's an idea. Toss some- Spicy love ... toss a few of these wild protein crackers into some Tupperware, take a spoonful of your Holy Chili, shake it up a little bit, and you've got a spicy variety.
Let's do it. We'll report back. There you go. Yeah, we're doing, we're doing- I see a new segment here. We've got Melissa's interesting ingredient of the week, which is- Colostrum ... colostrum. Colostrum. Just so you know, I have a new Substack that's called Recipes by Ray, 9.95 a month. By me. So don't look it up.
Oh. It doesn't exist. Does not exist. Wait wait, hold on. Our legal team just shut it down.
Summarize in paragraph form
Hey, folks. It's Ray with Taste Radio. Right now, I am supremely honored to be sitting down with Roberto Núñez and David Rodriguez of Patrón Tequila. Roberto, how are you? I'm great, Ray. Thank you for having us. It's an honor to be here. Thank you so much for having me here. And David, how are you? I'm so good.
Thank you so much for coming. I really appreciate it. Indeed. And we're here at Patrón's stunning hacienda in Jalisco. We just wrapped up a very impressive tour of your incredible and impressive distillery. I think for folks who are listening, they are probably very familiar with Patrón Tequila. One thing that's really stood out over the past couple days that I've been here has been the deep commitment to craft and tradition that is embedded in the culture here, and I imagine that's something that each of you takes great pride in, both personally and for the company as a whole.
Appreciate it. Yes. Thank you for the compliment. I had to be honest, all honor here to David Rodriguez, who is the one, the director of this orchestra of working bees that make this amazing juice that is Patrón. The, again, dedication to the quality of the products that I've been tasting over the past couple days has really struck a chord with me in a way I didn't expect, honestly.
And we have here one of your latest innovations, which is the Patrón One Hundred. With how we develop this product is because we need to listen our bartenders, but especially when they came here, they say, "Oh, I think the Patrón need to improve a special tequila, high proof," because some tequila consumers, they want to try the tequila with a tequila forward, good quality, but especially with the handcraft process.
This is one thing. The another thing is we receive the support for our ambassadors, for marketing team, all the advocacy team in US to receive the, all the feedback. It's the same thing. The bartenders over there in the US, they ask for a tequila, a high proof. Yeah, indeed, it is a high proof. It is 100 proof.
It's 50% alcohol, and I wanna get into the development on a distilling level of this product. But this is Patrón's first new product in two years, Roberto, and I'm wondering about the strategic impetus behind this launch and also the timing behind it as well. I think there is never a wrong time to have a new tequila, and especially if it's a great tequila this one.
But I think the timing is exactly, we've been listening to the market, how the knowledge of the tequila drinkers around the world has deepened, and they are asking for more agave-forward flavors. Bartenders across the U.S., I'm fortunate to host them here at the Hacienda Patrón, they like those bold flavors.
They love playing in cocktails with that, and we wanted to offer them that something that they've been asking for so long. But also, Patrón is the biggest producer of traditional tequila in the world. We are the biggest producers of tahona tequila in the world, so we wanted to make a statement that we been honoring tradition ever since we started, since 1989.
And I'd like to sip some. A quick toast to both of you and your entire team. Thank you so much for having us all here. Outstanding. Salud, Ray. Salud. And so for me, this is something I would never have in a cocktail because it's just so incredibly sippable and delicious and smooth on its own, and we're sipping it out of champagne flutes.
And one of the things that really threw me off about this product is that it is distilled to proof. I can't recall coming across a distilled to proof tequila, especially one like this, and I imagine that it was a very significant and challenging technical choice as well, and I wonder how that choice shapes the structure and integrity of this liquid and how it compares to your core lineup.
Yes. Yesterday you made a very good example. We use only three ingredients: agave, water, and yeast. Same equipment, same brick oven, same tahona, same pinewood fermenter, and same pot still. What is the difference here? The special—let me see, because it's my job is to play in different step in our process to identify new aromas and flavors.
I can tell how passionate you are about it. For folks who obviously can't see this recording David was leaning forward and kept leaning forward into his chair because of how happy he is about the process of making a product like Patrón One Hundred. We've mentioned the word tahona a number of times in the conversation so far.
Roberto, for folks who aren't familiar, what is tahona's production? What is it exactly and why is it so important to the Patrón brand? Tahona is a method of extraction on the process of agave spirits. Some people call it a Chilean mill. We call it traditional process because it's the oldest of these different methods.
There are other agave spirits who might use a mallet and it-- that might be even older. But in the tequila world, the tahona is the kind of the oldest that we use. It's a volcanic rock that goes around a pit and is smashing these agave fibers and extracting the juices of the cooked agave. And we love this method because it provides, even if it takes way longer, even if it's more time-consuming and it has needed more people, in Patrón, we are not here to do shortcuts.
As you saw, David is very passionate people, and what we want to do is achieve a specific flavor that it comes from this method, which is a little bit more minerality, earthiness, these type of sweet flavors that come from the whole method. The tahona is the starting of these two different process.
From the other side, we have the roller mill, in the case of the core line, the Patrón Silver. And in the other we have the tahona. It goes into fermentation with fibers and first distillation with fibers But something that both have, Patrón, Herradura and Corrale in common is the commitment to tradition, to passion, and to making a good tequila.
I am going to include in the show notes a video that I took of the tahona wheel grinding or rolling over the agave fibers, and it's a beautiful experience to see. And listeners may have seen something like this in the past, but it was very... in a very old way. It was donkeys pulling a cart that was attached to a wheel that was crushing the agave fibers.
Now it's all mechanical and e- and electric. It's still horsepower. It's just- Is there really? It's just different horsepower. It's horsepower, yes. We changed the donkeys for the horse- Okay. Okay. Well- ... power ... it's still... I was shocked seeing it because it feels like small batch, really authentic production.
And for a brand the size and scale of Patrón, it's surprising. It's not something I expected to see. And when I think about, maintaining that authenticity and that quality and scaling it across the... you have 18 wheels? 18 tahonas. 18 tahonas. How are you able to maintain that type of production, again, given the amount of product that you produce every day?
Someone told me today that you have the capacity to produce 6,000 nine-liter cases of product every day. Just let me tell you s- a story when we have here Francisco Alcaraz Orfalea, master distiller It's happened when we started here in, in this Hacienda Patrón in 2003, our production growing year by year.
The first year was 250,000, and 2004, 500,000 cases, and then we receive a lot pressure for the markets because in 2006 we get the first million. But they-- our salespeople ask for more. For that reason, they ask for our general manager here, "Hey, we need to request more, more tequila." The salespeople say that, "Okay, Francisco, David, please bring more big equipment like autoclaves, like a stainless steel tank."
More modern equipment. More modern equipment, and also column still. To what? To produce in mass. And Francisco said, "My friend, it's not Patrón. If we change our process, it's small batches." The-- What is the way to increase that production? Replicate the same area. That's the answer. Because if you see, we have Taunas one, two, three, four, five.
Also in Rosa de la Castilla, we have more areas to complete the 18 wheels, close to 100 post steel, more than 600 pine fermented wood. Also, we need to increase our capacity by replication, not automatization. That's the key component. Yes, we receive a lot of pressure, but Francisco at that time said, "No, if we change our process, at the end, this is not Patrón."
I think it reinforces Patrón as the top-selling super premium tequila in the category, what you do and your commitment to heritage production. In this group that I'm a part of are many bartenders and bar owners, and they have experienced the level of quality that you, again, are dedicated to here at your hacienda, and this is where your primary distillery is located.
There are two others- Yes ... located not too far from here. Obviously, their customers are becoming more educated, their patrons are becoming more educated about what they're drinking, and telling that story beyond the liquid, I think is important as well. Being able to share what they've experienced here and tell that to their customers is something that would give me, as a patron, would give me a little bit more of an appreciation of what I'm drinking.
What do you think really resonates with today's consumer? What do you think is the part of your story that you can tell pretty efficiently and in a way that's going to resonate with someone who's at a bar or a restaurant? I think there are a few messages. One of those is we are a handmade product. Traditional made, handcraft. We are also achieve all these flavors in a very natural way. In other words, an additive-free way with only three ingredients: agave, water, yeast, nothing else added. In the case of our age expressions, we use wood and that's it. And of course, is all this passion from the people who is behind crafting this tequila.
So we always say that every bottle of tequila Patrón is touched by 60 hands, which is the amount of people that is needed to produce one bottle of tequila Patrón. I think also as a former bar operator myself, I think people is always looking for a brand that they believe in their ethos, the way we do things.
It's not only use that tradition and the good flavors of Patrón, but it's also what we do for Mexico and for our people. Some rather use the word sustainability, that it doesn't mean anything if it's not correlated to people. So when we produce tequila in Patrón, we are always looking that our last step of the process is not when we bottle tequila, is when we are giving back to Mexico, and Mexico means our people.
Cleaning our water, our vinazas, our fibers, and bringing back to the community. So I think as a patron, as a bar owner, a bartender, I will always choose a brand that, yes, I like the taste, yes, I believe in their ethos, the way they do things and the methods they use, but also how they give back for Mexico and they treat the land of Mexico.
I can see that. You can see that on the floor of the distillery. You can see that throughout the hacienda. And one other thing that I have seen across the past couple days is This term, the Patrón way. People talk about, oh, there are other production methods, or, maybe this company does this thing, or these folks do these things this way, but there's the Patrón way, and it doesn't necessarily mean you have to compare it to anything else.
I never heard once somebody say, "Oh, other brands do this," or, "Other companies do this." You were never comparing yourself to anything. It was always, "This is what we do. This is the Patrón way." And I think that's also something that resonates throughout the company. It's- it seems very intentional that you're not necessarily looking to the right or left or front or back.
It's just, "This is how we do things here," David. Yes. Just let me remember one sentence that our founder made, John Paul DeJoria. He said, "Success on share is failure." That mean that we are not focused on obviously in our tequila. We are focused in our community, in our waste, and also in our compost, how we recover the fiber as, and a compost to send again for the next generation of the agave.
That's all the commitment that we have as a company to who is behind Patrón, who is behind this bottle, right? It's people, the big effort every day that they make for the his job all are so happy to work for Patrón, but also they are so proud because around here there is another distilleries. But when they say I work for Patrón," they- You get the thumbs up.
Yes. Yes. Also, the people is special because when I started in my career in, to work in the tequila distilleries, believe me, because I visit different distilleries in lowlands, in highlands, and but especially this area is is so nice to work. Roberto, David, thank you so much for taking the time today, and thank you so much for everything that you've shared with our group over the past couple days.
It's been an honor and very exciting and eye-opening for me personally, so I really appreciate it, and I think our listeners will have a deeper appreciation for Patrón the brand and the company and how you carry yourselves as stewards of this amazing brand. So thank you again. Thank you, Ray, for visiting us.
You are always welcome to come back again. Hope to see you very soon. I appreciate that. Thank you so much. Ray, thank you so much for coming. I am so happy that you are here to see what is behind this for every bottle that we make. You see what is exactly that the message that Patrón want to send for the people.
It's all the passion. It's all the efforts that is in the bottle. Thank you so much. Thank you again, and once again, cheers. Salud. Cheers. Salud. Salud. Salud
