[00:00:10] Ray Latif: Hey folks, I'm Ray Latif and you're listening to the number one podcast for the food and beverage industry Taste Radio. This episode features an interview with Jim, Jake and Jordan DeCicco, the co-founders of fast growing better for you coffee and energy brand, Super Coffee. Just a reminder to our listeners, if you like what you hear on Taste Radio, please share the podcast with friends and colleagues. And of course, we would love it if you could review us on the Apple Podcasts app or your listening platform of choice. Super Coffee is one of the fastest-growing entrepreneurial beverage brands in recent memory, yet brothers and co-founders Jim Jake and Jordan DeCicco often say that they're just getting warmed up. In the seven years since Jordan created the brand in his college dorm room, Super Coffee has become a significant player in the multi-billion dollar RTD coffee category. Over the past two years, the company has ramped up distribution via a partnership with beer giant Anheuser-Busch InBev and fueled an expansion into new retail channels supported by a $106 million Series C funding round completed at a valuation of $500 million. Earlier this year, Super Coffee announced its foray into energy drinks with the launch of Super Energy, a line of premium sparkling beverages made with natural ingredients. While the brand continues to be on a positive trajectory, operational challenges caused by the COVID-19 pandemic and an increasingly rigid M&A environment for beverage brands have required the DeCicco brothers to reconsider and revise parts of their business, in particular Super Coffee's core line of products. In an interview featured as part of Taste Radio's live podcast and meetup event in Austin, which was held in September, I spoke with Jim, Jake and Jordan about how shifting headwinds have influenced recent business decisions, the impact of COVID on innovation, and what they've learned from being on the front lines of distribution and merchandising since the outset of the pandemic. They also explain the value of quote, being the world's foremost experts on Super Coffee, and how they communicate exit planning to the Super Coffee team. All right, I'm Ray Latif, the editor and producer of BevNET's Taste Radio podcast, the number one podcast for the food and beverage industry. It's so amazing to see everyone here today, and it's incredibly amazing to be sitting down with three fine gentlemen, the founders of Super Coffee, Jordan, Jake, and Jimmy DeCicco. Thank you guys so much. Guys, this place is incredible. I walked in here, not right off the street, that'd be kind of weird, but I walked in here today and I looked in and I was like, this office is insane. And the setup that you guys provided for us is just amazing. Thank you so much again. How long have you been here? We've been here about 18 months and thank you guys for making this happen. You guys brought this event to life. Appreciate you saying that. It took a team, it took your team. We all worked well together and I'm really happy that it came together. You've been here for 18 months, but Super Coffee recently celebrated a birthday. Seven years. Seven years. June 2015 to June 2022. I have to think that this is kind of a trip for you guys to be here at this stage of development. I mean, it all happened pretty quickly. If you could describe in one word your feelings about this seven-year ride, we'll start there. Jordan? Emotional. Jake?
[00:03:43] Super Coffee: Tiring.
[00:03:46] Ray Latif: Evolution. Indeed, it has been an evolution. It takes a team, it takes a village, it takes a community to build a beverage brand. And along the way, a lot of advice is shared. And there's a lot of folks here in the room, they're asking for and they're getting advice. And there's no shortage of people that want to offer advice. Jimmy, you know, How do you and the team at Super Coffee ask for advice? And how do you determine what is the best advice you should be asking for?
[00:04:16] Super Energy: Yeah, it's a great question. And I got to be careful what I say. One of our board members is sitting in the front row. No, in all seriousness, we actually came up with a sort of a formula for this. And it's advice comes from people you trust, you know, and our formula for trust is, is the person credible? You know, are they well recommended? This is a small industry, you can vet anybody that you're speaking to, does this person have a good track record? Are they credible? So credibility is one. Reliability, do they do what they say they're going to do? Right? Are they on time? Do they deliver? Do they make the connections they say they're going to make? Do they follow up? And then the third is authenticity, right? Are they legitimate? Are they uniquely themselves? Or are they pretending to be like somebody? You take all of those things. If the person you're seeking advice from checks all three of those boxes, You divide it over self-interest, right? Why do they wanna give you advice? Do they want shares in your company? Are they trying to get rich from you? What is their motive here? And I think we've made a lot of mistakes in the early days of Super Coffee, trusting people because maybe they were credible. Maybe they had a real background and worked at big companies, but their self-interest was not in our best interest or the company's best interest. So I think that trust equation is critical for how we grade advisors, how we grade new hires, how we grade executives that we work with. And that's served us well so far.
[00:05:33] Ray Latif: Jordan, do all three of you have to agree when you are bringing on a strategic advisor or dare I say an investor? The three of us rarely agree on anything.
[00:05:43] Taste Radio: One thing we've learned over the past seven years is that it's always great for the three of us to come together and discuss ideas, discuss opportunities, right? And whether or not we always agree, we're always going to push each other to get to the best outcome. And a lot of times it's more business focused, but in the more recent years, raising large rounds of capital, partnering with some pretty influential folks, we have had those conversations. And the majority of the time, we do agree that, look, we have a very specific set of shared values. Our culture, our team is near and dear to our heart. So the people that we partner with, we also want to share the same values with, right? The same mission, the same vision. So we take that very seriously. But, you know, realistically, we're not going to agree on everything. And that's okay, too. We trust each other. To Jim's point, trust is the fundamental aspect of our relationship, not only as brothers, but as co-founders. So if we can't trust each other, if we can't get that alignment pretty, pretty easily, then it's going to be tough to run the business together.
[00:06:40] Ray Latif: Trust, certainly important, but getting past the disagreements you have, you know, what happens when you have this disagreement? So I can go back to you one more time, Jordan.
[00:06:47] Taste Radio: Yeah, I think one, we're fortunate to have an amazing team around us too, right? So the three of us do not have to make every decision. And we certainly don't have the conversations in a silo. We pull in our amazing executive team, our amazing leadership team. We love going further down, closer to the action when we have to make hard decisions on the business. And then obviously a great board as well who supports us. Now we don't have to wait for our next board meeting to pick up the phone and call one of our board members to get feedback or anybody in the industry who we've built a relationship with. You know, I would say, look, we try to leverage data and reference data, obviously, as much as we can to make it as objective as possible. Where we bump heads the most is on the most subjective topics. And in that setting, we try to lean into the subject matter experts, the person who oversees that domain. If it's in ops or product, you know, I'll leverage all of the resources that I have available. Ultimately, Jimmy and Jake will trust that we make the best decision there. If it's on the sales front, obviously that is where Jake lives, breathes, and spends all of his waking time and energy. I cannot, you know, veto a decision that Jake's gonna make. If he has full confidence and the analysis is sharp and we've gotten outside perspectives, then let's go do it.
[00:07:52] Ray Latif: Yeah, Jake, you've got some Super Energy in front of you. Brand extension you guys launched earlier this year. I think it surprised a few people when you guys got into the energy drink business. What was the advice you heard in that regard?
[00:08:05] Super Coffee: I think we just looked at the category and it's a really, really exciting one. And we wanted to test within that category. So I think first and foremost, the advice was stay close to home, right? We've always had a rule of thumb from the earliest days at Super Coffee, which is win where you live, right? So we did a test and we still are testing it at H-E-B here in Texas, have a really clear scorecard of what success looks like. But ultimately, you know, we wanted to listen to a lot of our partners, what they want, both at the retail level and at the wholesaler level. A lot of our wholesalers were impacted by the news that happened when Celsius left the Anheuser-Busch system and went to Pepsi. So, you know, we've been kicking around an energy drink idea for probably the better part of two years. And I think to come in with a differentiated product, you know, we're not big fans of artificial sweeteners. That's kind of been our MO from day one at Super Coffee. So we think that there is a lane that we can play in within this category, be similar to some of the brands that are having a lot of success like Celsius or C4. but have a different sweetener system and some different value added benefits and see how the tests go and go to some of our best partners and some of our best wholesalers and test it really closely.
[00:09:20] Ray Latif: It's something your wholesalers wanted is what I'm hearing.
[00:09:23] Super Coffee: I mean, we've innovated a lot, right? We've been pretty far and wide. We've had some things work really well. We've had other things that we've unfortunately had to discontinue. But with energy, Super Energy, that was probably the first time that we were listening very closely to wholesaler requests, right? And when you can get tailwinds like that, and you can get your partners excited and what we call high leverage launch opportunities, you know, we'd like to take those bets. And there have been times that we've launched innovation against the request of people, right? And you're going into an innovation with a headwind, and some of your competitive nature comes out and you want to prove people wrong or, or go into a big attractive category. And, you know, tailwinds are better than headwinds at the end of the day.
[00:10:04] Ray Latif: Yeah. I think, is that on your hat, Jake, is that the blueberry flavor?
[00:10:08] Super Coffee: Cinnamon roll.
[00:10:09] Ray Latif: Cinnamon roll, but... The cinnamon roll. Okay. That's the blueberry muffin. There's the blueberry right there. Yeah. Jordan, your idea was to introduce a blueberry muffin flavor, right? Um, yeah, it was, it was. Let's pause there for a second, because it wasn't as well received as it was in your mind. And I mean, within the team.
[00:10:29] Taste Radio: Yeah, early on. So we, this is actually where we started to add a little bit more, more discipline around our innovation, because I would always, you know, throw out these, these types of things. And to Jake's point, some, some work, some don't. But about two and a half years ago, we started really investing in consumer insights, upping our investment, learning more about our consumers. consumers that were buying the products or real people that we could actually have conversations with, the people that we're serving every day and that are keeping us in business and choosing, you know, to give us their business over, say, a Starbucks. And one of the questions we ask is, what would you like to see more from Super Coffee in the future? And the answer that a lot of them gave was more unique and exciting flavors. They did not say blueberry muffin flavor. But, you know, we took that advice and feedback and we said, okay, how could we get a little bit more creative, you know, beyond just the standard vanilla, mocha, latte, caramel latte, which are mainstays in the category, you need those items, but really differentiate ourselves and still provide a meaningful you know, value set for the consumer that's telling us they want something more creative. So after several battles, you know, with Jimmy on this one, you know, we did a lot of explorations, a lot of testing. Two years ago, we decided to do a small test of not blueberry muffin, but blueberry latte as a spring summer seasonal, which again, kind of our way of dipping our toe in the water. And it performed really well. I mean, people were really excited about it. It was our most successful launch online ever, and retail velocities were really strong on it. So then what we decided to do was, okay, how can we make this even better, build on the feedback that we got? And not only did we then evolve that product into Blueberry Muffin, But we also launched cinnamon roll and caramel waffle and created an entire tasty pastry line for our distributors and retailers. So we actually got a lot more value out of that initial idea. But it didn't come from just guessing overnight. It came from talking to your consumers, getting an understanding of what they'd be interested in, and then creating something that we thought added unique value that was actually meaningful to them. And then we tested it, proved it out, and then expanded it from there.
[00:12:31] Ray Latif: Yeah, let's stick with that for a second. Jimmy, the reset for Super Coffee's RTD line, indulgent flavors, focus on the bottled products, all part of a shift that happened within the past year or so. Can you talk about that shift in the context of your overall growth strategy and how it was impacted by COVID?
[00:12:50] Super Energy: Yeah, and I think at a certain point in COVID towards the end of 2020, everybody, every American, everybody that was impacted by lockdowns and quarantines and just a new way of living was tired. We were all burnt out. We missed excitement. We missed our lives. One of the insights we had, it was truly that people wanted a break from the bullshit, right? Whether that was politics on the news or mixed messages from health professionals not being able to do the things they once enjoyed doing. So fun flavors were that break, it was that exciting new reason to drive trial. I think one thing that was unique about this Tasty Pastry launch is we have been more data driven lately. But the trouble with data is it makes you think you know what your customers want. Nothing in the data says go launch a blueberry muffin Super Coffee, right? The data tells you to launch vanilla, mocha, coffee, hazelnut, right? Those are the best selling products in all of bottled coffee. So kudos to Jordan for having the courage to push through with this one. And it was a great excitement for the brand. It was a great reason to really sell in the whole portfolio into more lines. And it's been a great product for us this year.
[00:13:54] Jake Jordan: Yeah, I would say so. Guessing your margins? That's risky. Belay Financial gives CPG brands the clarity to scale smarter, faster, stronger. Get your free inventory ebook by texting TASTE to 55123 and start making data work for you. Vibrant Ingredients is the natural ingredient partner powering food and beverage innovation, delivering flavor, function, and protection through a science-backed portfolio. Vibrant delivers purpose-driven solutions that help brands create extraordinary experiences. Discover what's possible with Vibrant today. Visit VibrantIngredients.com
[00:14:43] Ray Latif: Jake, when we spoke last, you talked about some lessons, some really important lessons that were hammered home during COVID. Number one, people aren't going to execute for you. And number two, our job starts after the product gets on shelves.
[00:14:58] Super Coffee: Can you elaborate on both? Yeah, I mean, I think the challenge of being in food and beverage, unless you're an e-commerce company is, you know, you gotta start by having your products available on shelves, right? Like that is, and getting there, right? Like physically getting to the shelf and, you know, the whole world was impacted by the frontline labor force. And our distributor partners, you know, here in Austin, Texas, we have a great partner in Brown Distributing. They've been down 30 to 50 merchandisers since March of 2020, right? That is a challenge. And you sit in your pecking order based off your volume. So, we learned, you know, we have velocity problems. Like, we're not immune to any of the problems that every brand faces. We have velocity problems. We have cash burn problems. We have marketing problems. We have sales problems. But at the end of the day, if our product isn't on shelves, we can't even tackle any of those problems. Right. So I think that was one thing that was highlighted the most during COVID was like, hey, we need to prioritize the frontline, we need to make sure that we're getting product on shelves, which a lot of the time, you know, here in Austin, we have 25 people in this office, they'll take days. you know, our marketing team, our accounting team, where they just go out and make sure products on shelves and five to 10 stores. So I think that was highlighted. And that's, I mean, that's basic blocking tackling. But then a core ideology that we've always believed in, and I think you'll see a lot of the successful beverage brands do is, you know, getting an authorization at a store, whether it's Publix, it's HEB, wherever it is, a lot of folks high five and they're like, okay, let's go get the next authorization. But truthfully, you know, that is when your work begins. And the only thing that's going to help you get more authorizations is by being successful where you are, right? So just making sure that you fall in love with that customer, that customer falls in love with you, and you understand you know, which levers you can pull for your brand to be successful, and then go replicate that at your next retailer, versus trying to get another retailer and another retailer, because the very attractive and easy way to get short term growth is by getting into more doors. But the only way that you're going to last and stick, right, is having a recipe where you say, hey, I can invest in this, and it will drive this return. Both those things highlighted from from the beginning, and then even more during the COVID years.
[00:17:13] Ray Latif: Jordan, Jake made it clear that COVID has impacted the business quite a bit. Has it impacted your long-term vision for the brand and your long-term strategy? And if so, how do you communicate that shift to your team and to your partners?
[00:17:28] Taste Radio: Yeah, I think one thing we realized during COVID is that you can have a great plan, a long-term plan or even just an annual plan. And in the blink of an eye, it can get flipped upside down. And it's a big part of why we focus on culture so much, building great teams and putting in the work every single day and being nimble and ready to evolve and adapt when the time comes. I mean, during COVID, I mean, in March 2020, we moved out of New York City and moved back in with our parents in North Carolina. And for the entire month of April, all we did was reset shelves at Publix because they weren't going to have anybody go into the stores to stock shelves.
[00:18:05] Ray Latif: You three were physically going into the stores?
[00:18:06] Taste Radio: Every single store. Probably not all 1,200 Publix, but there was quite a few from North Carolina to Florida. And yes, it's exactly what we did all April long when we were at our parents before we went back to New York. But that was never a part of the plan that year, right? We were supposed to have, you know, an incredible year with no issues. And that's the issue with planning sometimes is you draw up your blue sky scenarios and you think and expect everything to go well. And then all of a sudden, you know, things change and you have to be ready to do that. But that starts really deep in your foundation with your team and your culture. And that's something that we've always taken very seriously from day one. So now when we think about the business, obviously we are getting better at planning, taking these things into account, understanding things aren't always going to go according to plan, but then always making sure the team is ready to adapt. So when shit does happen, You know, you guys, you can look at each other calmly, comfortably, and say, okay, now we got to get creative. Now we got to lean into our purpose, our mission, our vision, our core values. Those are the things that really matter the most. And we got to dig in here and come up with the best outcomes and solutions for the business. and obviously we are a, you know, we've always been very growth-oriented, but, you know, sometimes growth might not be the answer, especially when you're going up against something like COVID, you might just want to maintain, right? Maintain distribution, maintain the team, maintain the culture, and I think that's shifted our focus quite a bit. and really forcing us to think about, okay, it's not growth at all cost, how can we become more efficient, optimize the business over time, so we can be a lot more stable, and then, you know, be disciplined, but also more strategic about where we're spending our dollars as we think about the next three, five, 10 years out.
[00:19:44] Ray Latif: You want to know your team. You want to know that your team has your back. You also want to know your business inside and out. And Jimmy, you've expressed that it's so important for entrepreneurs to have that knowledge about their business. You've talked about how you guys are the foremost experts of supercopy. Can you talk about and articulate the value of that knowledge?
[00:20:03] Super Energy: Yeah, I think our business is so unique, especially in a year like 2022. It's great to learn from the brands that come before. I think the sort of darlings of our industry are the vitamin waters, the buys, the Honest Tea, the body armors, right? And every entrepreneur looks at those brands and says, wow, what an outcome. How do we get to that? The reality is nobody's built a DSD coffee business in 2022 under these circumstances, except for Let me put it this way, there's other coffee brands out there, nobody's built Super Coffee this year. And when we went on Shark Tank in 2017, we were nervous to sit in front of these entrepreneurs, the best entrepreneurs of our time. And what we said to each other was, these guys don't know more about Super Coffee than we do, right? And that sort of gave us confidence. So I think as important as it is to learn from those who came before you, I think it's also important to recognize that one, the right way is the way that works. And two, there's no playbook, right? Especially in unprecedented times, there's no playbook. So I think to George's point, being nimble, being able to adjust is critical. And then knowing your business inside now, and kudos to our president, Tyler Ricks. He's always been Honest Tea you can't manage what you can't measure. And since he's joined the team, we've really gotten a crystal clear picture in that data, in that numbers. And that's forced us to make hard decisions like move out of product lines and double down on others. So I think knowing your business cold helps you navigate some of these waters. And then sometimes you have to make bets that aren't in the data, like putting blueberry in a coffee bottle. I still think that's a stupid idea.
[00:21:36] Ray Latif: You said it. No, and I do think the blueberry flavor is amazing. I think all your flavors are amazing. But one of the things that you often have to explain is why you're doing something. And why you're doing something to your investors is that conversation you have to have. And sometimes that's a stickier conversation, no pun intended, than it might seem. And Jimmy, if I can stick with you one more time, you know, talking about expertise and the expertise of knowing your business, how do you talk about that with your investors? I mean, is that a conversation that can be kind of tricky sometimes?
[00:22:07] Super Energy: Yeah, no, we do it every day. And it is tricky because we turn to our investors and our advisors who have way more experience in this industry than we do. So not only do we value their perspective, we also have to educate on what happens every day. I think the challenge in any startup is so much happens in the course of a week. that when you're talking to a board member or an investor once a month or once a quarter, it's impossible to catch them up to speed on everything that just happened in the last 12 hours. So I think one, partnering with investors and advisors who trust the entrepreneurs to run the company is critical. And we've been very lucky and grateful to have those people in our corner. And then two, earning their trust, right? Doing what you say you're going to do, delivering, pivoting for good reason, pivoting for context. I think you cannot communicate enough. And that's one piece of feedback sort of looking back on my last couple years. I think I communicate a lot, but certainly not enough. So to anybody out there, even if nothing changes from week to week, no update is still an update. Right? When people don't have the full picture, they go to a really bad place in their heads. So give people as many updates as you possibly can. So in an effort to really keep them all on the same page and informed in the decisions that you're making. Yeah.
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[00:24:14] Ray Latif: Sometimes the investor is going to go to a dark place, but sometimes you're in the dark place and you're worried about lots of things. And in an environment where, you know, for the past few years, nothing has been normal. Jake, what keeps you up at night? What are you most concerned about going into 2023 and beyond?
[00:24:32] Super Coffee: You know, I think the thing that keeps us up most at night, I mean, the three of us share this, Jim will actually have a different answer, because he has a very specific one. But, you know, ultimately, thinking about our team, right? And are they set up for success? Do we have alignment at the top of the org chart that's going to lead to success at the bottom of the org chart? Are we putting our team in a position where they, you know, can go out and have shared consciousness? And that's something that we've always talked about from when we were a five or 10 person team to now 135 person team is like, do we have the right level of shared consciousness where, you know, an entry level person, you know, if they were facing an important decision would make the same decision that the three of us would make? And obviously, we're all facing different levels of decisions based off of where we fall on the org chart. But you know, that entry level person, if they're making a big decision, hopefully, it's the same way that the three of us would answer it. And I think that does come with a lot of to Jim's point, over communication, right, continuing to always share your values and your expectations with your team. And ultimately, knowing that if you do have to make a hard decision, that they can do that in a safe way where you have their back so long as they follow the values of the company, right? Because if you make a value-based decision that falls within the company values, 9 out of 10 times, you're going to be okay with that, even if it does come at a financial risk or a financial shortcoming, but it was in the right values and right integrity in the moment. So, I think that's really what keeps us up at night is just making sure the team is positioned for success, specifically as the stakes seemingly get higher. Every year we go into the business, we have more money at stake. We have a bigger plan. It's ultimately them and their families that, you know, represent Super Coffee just as much as the three of us.
[00:26:18] Ray Latif: team, culture, understanding who you are, your core values, all important. But is it important for someone to get and understand what the company is about from day one, or do they have to be educated? They have to, I guess, be taught about what the culture is and what it represents. Jordan?
[00:26:34] Taste Radio: Yeah, I mean, it starts within the recruiting process, right? Before they even start day one, before they get an offer to join the organization, you know, we have a pretty clear process and set of expectations for our people operations team. when they're going out and looking for candidates. We're fortunate enough where if we post a role, we might get 200, 300 candidates for any given post. And I think that it's important for us to know, how are we going to qualify these people? What are the filters that we're going to put on, you know, job search? But then for the candidate, They need to feel, if we do feel like they could be a good fit based on their resume and based on some early conversations, they need to feel the same love, you know, respect and care that we put forth every single day. They need to understand our values in the recruiting process so they can also size us up and say, is this a good decision? Because it should be clear to them too, coming into the company, what they're getting into, right? We'd never want a candidate to feel like they were oversold on the opportunity or that we're one thing and then they start day one and now we're something completely different. So I think setting candidates up for success, setting high expectations, having transparent conversations is critical throughout that process. But then on day one, we go through a rigorous onboarding process as well, just to make sure they feel like they're a part of something bigger than themselves, right? That's the ultimate goal for us. I mean, our mission is to mass produce positive energy. If everybody on the team doesn't feel that way every single day, we're ultimately not going to achieve the ambitions that we want to achieve. And it starts by bringing on great people. So we look for people who can add value, not just to the culture, but also obviously as a performer can enhance our collective performance.
[00:28:07] Ray Latif: Ambition is really important for entrepreneurs in our industry. It's why you do what you do in so many ways. And in that conversation, there's a discussion about an exit. And I've heard different conversations from different people about how you should think about talking about an exit, how you should communicate the term with your team, with your partners. Jimmy, do you guys think about that very often? I mean, is it something where, is it taboo in the office or is it a conversation you have to have?
[00:28:36] Super Energy: Yeah, I think knowing the audience, right? Like whether you're with your employees, it might be a different conversation than when you're with your investors. I think the elephant in the room is some investors don't wanna hear that you're building a business to sell it, but the reality is when you're a growth brand and you're raising money, those investors expect to make their money back somehow, you know? And really there's two routes. It's an IPO through a SPAC or a public process, or it's a partnership with a strategic acquirer. And two things, one, if you're building a business to sell it, Don't do it. I think what we learned over the last seven years is this is the hardest business in the world to make money in. The second thing is, if you do not love what you do, your business will never get sold, right? You have to create value, not only for your customers, but for your investors, for a strategic acquirer. And the game has changed completely over the last seven years. When we got started, this was right when buy got acquired for $1.7 billion from Dr. Pepper. This was a growth brand. Investors were pumping money into venture capital. It was grow, grow, grow, feed on the street, DSD, support your accounts, you know, deep promos, Super Bowl commercials, the whole deal. And in the last two years, it's, why aren't you profitable? And that's not a switch that you can flip, right? That's an entirely different strategy when you build an organization around growth. So I think it's been a total about face for a lot of brands in our industry, us for certain, and we're grateful. I mean, we've had the support, the funding to survive that type of transformation, but a lot of brands haven't. So I think leveling up to adjust to that change has really been our critical, just how we spent our time these last 12 months.
[00:30:08] Ray Latif: Timing wise, I guess, and this is maybe too specific a question, but do you have a vision in terms of that time frame for an exit? Is it something where you say, we have to be able to do this in a certain amount of time, or is it, let's just grow at the pace that we think is going to be best to deliver that kind of value that you were talking about, Jimmy?
[00:30:28] Super Energy: Well, so when we raised our Series B, I told our investors we would sell in 2020. And then I told him it'd be 2021. And no, I think in all seriousness, that level of success has changed. When we first started this business, Coke's VEB's proof of concept was $10 million in sales. Today, they don't look at anything less than 100 million, right? They're divesting from Honest Tea, they're divesting from Zico. So that bar is always moving as the level. I think what they learned from some of these acquisitions is that Coke is such a monster and Dr. Pepper is such a big machine that they can't be helpful to a small brand that doesn't have the distribution. So when we talk about exit, I think we talk about comps, you know, you look at brands like Celsius, you look at body armor, you show where they are, where they're winning, what size were they? I think the reality is great businesses are bought and not sold, right? So you can build an amazing business and if there's no buyer for it, like that's a timing thing too, versus you might not be ready for an exit, but if there's a buyer who needs a bottle of coffee in their portfolio, there could be an opportunity to sell sooner than later. What you need to see now is great growth, clear differentiation in a category that exists and profitability. You know, that gross margin has got to be 40% or more in beverage. We know that number well.
[00:31:38] Super Coffee: Did you say a buyer that's listening to this podcast that needs a bottle of coffee? Coke.
[00:31:42] Super Energy: If you're out there, we'll take a billion.
[00:31:44] Super Coffee: Is that what that was?
[00:31:46] Ray Latif: Well, we're going to be speaking with one of your investors in about 30 minutes and talk about how she feels about the development of the company and where you guys are going. I have a feeling she feels pretty good about it, but we'll have to hear from her exactly. But in the meantime, gentlemen, congratulations on everything that you've accomplished to this point. It is really remarkable. I was on stage with you guys when you joined our New Beverage Showdown about six years ago. Which we lost. We did. We lost. You know what? I don't know if she's still here, but Bella Hughes, who's one of the co-founders of Shotka Tea, she recently sold her company. The winner of that competition was Poppy, which won it as mother beverage. So if you think about three of those brands that were in the competition, it is insane. It is really remarkable to see what you guys have all done. It's just amazing. Thank you so much for joining me today. Thank you. Thank you, brother. That brings us to the end of this episode of Taste Radio. Thank you so much for listening. And thanks to our guests, Jim, Jake and Jordan Disico. As always, for questions, comments, ideas for future podcasts, please send us an email to askatasteradio.com. On behalf of the entire Taste Radio team, thank you for listening. And we'll talk to you next time.
