[00:00:10] Ray Latif: Hello, and thanks for tuning in to Taste Radio, the number one podcast for The Good and beverage industry. I'm Ray Latif, the editor and producer of Taste Radio, and with my BevNET and Notch colleagues, Jacqui Brugliera, Mike Schneider, and Brad Avery. In this episode, we feature the latest edition of The Maxi Minutes featuring investor Maxine Kozler, along with an on-the-ground Report From cocktail convention, Tales of The Cocktail, which was held this past week in New Orleans. I am excited to give that report because I'm the one who's down there in The Hot, hot, hot South. Now, what's funny about New Orleans, I've only been there once in my life. And it was in 2000 and it was for Mardi Gras. And if you've ever wanted to see a million people on a single street, that being Bourbon Street, that was your shot. It was insane. And yeah, it's not so much that way nowadays, I don't think, but Tales of The Cocktail, quite a busy event for sure. How many Sazeracs did you have? To be determined, I still need to count that up.
[00:01:18] Maxine Kozler: I'm looking forward to visiting The Hot, hot, hot South as well in the future.
[00:01:23] Ray Latif: Well, what does that mean?
[00:01:25] New Orleans: Yeah, I love New Orleans. I've been a bunch. Uh, my friend lives there right now and I love Frenchman street. So keep going down bourbon, hit Frenchman. And that's a little less busy, some really cool little jazz bars and it's fun.
[00:01:44] Maxine Kozler: I love it. Jackie's never a sellout. She knows like the local stuff. She just, she tries to get immersed herself when she goes places. I love it.
[00:01:51] New Orleans: I walk by all the touristy things. I maybe stop at one and then I just keep walking.
[00:01:56] Brad Avery: I'm the same way. I don't really go for too much of the touristy stuff. I like to just sort of like experience the city or wherever I'm going. So I try to be like, oh, where's just like a good place to hang out rather than like, oh, you need to go see this statue or take this bus tour.
[00:02:11] Maxine Kozler: You two are just a couple of old souls. And that's why I love you so much.
[00:02:14] New Orleans: I do love my beignets, though. And really good tiki scene in New Orleans, too. Some great tiki drinks.
[00:02:22] Ray Latif: Well, the beignets, I still remember, I think it was a video you put on Instagram when you went there last, New Orleans last, Jackie, and you were eating your beignets. And I was just like, oh man, I can't wait to get to the city and have a beignet a day, at least.
[00:02:38] New Orleans: Yeah. And the trick is you got to shake the bag up with the beignets and the powdered sugar inside of it, or else you get a very uneven coating. So shake the bag.
[00:02:47] Maxine Kozler: Jackie also likes to try to get noobs to inhale their beignets too.
[00:02:52] New Orleans: There is a choking hazard.
[00:02:54] Brad Avery: Ray, you should start one of those travel blogs where it's like beignet a day and it's sort of more a valuable lesson about life as you eat a beignet every day. And that was Jackie's last day at Batman.
[00:03:07] Ray Latif: I feel like that could be a podcast. Yeah. I'm trademarking that as soon as we're done.
[00:03:13] New Orleans: Spinoff.
[00:03:15] Ray Latif: Yeah. Two episodes. Ended. You know what would be kind of cool is a beignet flavored beverage. I bet people would buy that, wouldn't they? You know, that sort of like a bready, sweet type of flavor in a beverage. I mean, no? Sounds like something Ugly Drinks would have done back in the day. Yeah, exactly. Yes, our dearly departed Ugly Drinks.
[00:03:39] New Orleans: Sounds like drinking syrup.
[00:03:41] Ray Latif: Just thinking like a beer. Oh, a beignet beer.
[00:03:44] New Orleans: Oh my god. Brad with all the ideas.
[00:03:47] Maxine Kozler: Yeah. A beignet stout perhaps or beignet porter.
[00:03:51] Brad Avery: There you go. There you go. I bet you there is one. I'm sure there is. They've done it all. Someone's done it. Someone's done it.
[00:03:57] Ray Latif: Well, what I was thinking about, you know, when you go in to buy a beignet, when you go into the bakery, they just like the aromas are just like, oh my gosh, it smells so good. And in a beverage, oftentimes the first thing that you experience is that smell, is that scent. You see where I'm going with this, folks? You see where I'm going? You see the segue I'm trying to build up here? Brad, you recently wrote a story about how PepsiCo has invested in a, quote, scent-flavored hydration system. I'm just gonna stop and let you explain.
[00:04:31] Brad Avery: So this is a German company called AirUp. They were founded in 2019. And PepsiCo is one of their primary investors alongside a number of institutional firms. And also Ashton Kutcher and Guy Osiris are also back in the company. They've raised about 60 million euros to date in three years. So they're coming to the US now as a direct-to-consumer product. And basically, what this company is, They make a beverage system, one of those refillable water bottles with scented flavor pods and flavor should kind of be in air quotes because the idea is that you drink plain water and these pods attach on and they're scented. And so you drink water and as you're drinking, you inhale the smell and then you sort of, it tricks your brain into thinking that there is a flavor when there isn't really. So it's sort of a kind of neat concept to begin with. And then they sell these sort of single use scent pods and the water bottle can be used indefinitely. Isn't that what Zent did with their stickers on the bottle? Come on. It's exactly what Zent did, although Zent was RTD.
[00:05:49] Ray Latif: Yeah, exactly. Zent is a brand spelled S-Z-E-N-T, a ready-to-drink, single-serve beverage.
[00:05:57] Brad Avery: Now, I don't know if there's any technical differences between how Aerop is doing this and how Zent did it, but The Maxi difference is that Zent was an RTD product and the bottle was designed so that there was a little kind of a thing around the bottle cap rim. Right, they basically had smelly bottles. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And this is a reusable water bottle. There's sports caps and straws, and you can customize it and get it different colors. And then you buy these three-pack flavor pods for $7.99, and they can just roll The Hot pretty frequently. I think Zent only had about four or five flavors, and they've already got 10 here. So it allows for a bit quicker innovation. If I was a better marketer, I'd say aromatic bottles, of course, but they're using the term retro nasal smell, which is interesting.
[00:06:47] New Orleans: Wow. So technical.
[00:06:49] Brad Avery: I think that's going to blow up because, you know, science sells. I do think it's interesting, though. We've seen a lot of activity in The Hot of beverage system category, I guess you would call it, where, you know, The Hot of custom proprietary water bottles with a sort of novel approach. You know, you've seen there's that brand Circle that raised about thirty million dollars last year. There's the micro drink maker Waterdrop, which designs those sort of tiny flavor pods that can be used with their own bottles. I believe there's VitaPod is another that's doing something in a similar space. And so we've seen a lot of these type of beverage system products hit the market or raise significant capital over the past several years. And so it's interesting to see another kind of come to market with something that is rather novel in its approach.
[00:07:40] New Orleans: Yeah. I mean, looking at the article too, it looks like Drinkfinity is another one from Pepsi.
[00:07:46] Brad Avery: Well, Drinkfinity is an interesting example, because that one actually did not take off in the way that it was intended to. PepsiCo developed Drinkfinity internally and launched it in the US in 2018 after a pilot run in Brazil. And that was sort of a custom bottle that had two-ounce liquid pods that you could crush into your water and infuse flavor then and there. It launched in 2018, but it was instantly redesigned with a new bottle the next year. And then by 2020, there were reports that it had already gone off the market. I, while Googling, saw that you could still buy the bottles off of Bed Bath & Beyond's website, but I couldn't find anywhere to buy the flavor pods.
[00:08:29] New Orleans: Yeah, they've moved on.
[00:08:31] Brad Avery: But it is interesting because this was a PepsiCo product and now PepsiCo is still interested in the space clearly coming in as an investor for AirUp. So clearly, I'm interested in whether PepsiCo is looking at what they did with Drinkfinity and still seeing a chance to make the beverage system proprietary water bottle concept work in their favor by getting behind this brand.
[00:08:56] Ray Latif: Dogged investigative journalism by Brad Avery looking up. Still available on Bed Bath & Beyond. It's a Google search away. No, in all seriousness, I think, you know, for me, it's like, who's buying these products? Apparently AirUp is, I guess they have a significant business in Europe, but I mean, is that going to translate to the US? I don't, I don't know. I'm going to be kind of a hater on this. I just don't see many people buying this product.
[00:09:25] Maxine Kozler: Sounds like something that would be like a special vending machine in an airport and you'd have to use your phone to buy it. I can see that. I see where you're going with that. You see? That is the question.
[00:09:34] Brad Avery: Yeah. They say they're in 10 countries and they say they have 2 million customers and they also have close to 300 employees. One interview they said 240 and they've been saying close to 300 now, you know, so they clearly got a lot going on behind this but I do think there is that question of. Ultimately, where do they take this from an innovation approach? Because I think there's that sort of novelty of the scent element. But the question will be, you know, is this something you want to keep going back to and, you know, purchasing repeatedly? I'm just picturing the in-store demos.
[00:10:08] Maxine Kozler: Hey, Jackie, come on over and smell this.
[00:10:11] Ray Latif: Well, that's the thing. I mean, they're not going to be in store. I mean, I just don't expect this to be in store. I feel like this is, you know, D to C for life. And, you know, it just it wouldn't make a lot of sense.
[00:10:21] New Orleans: I mean, if you look at Circle and the success that they've had on TikTok going viral, this is another concept that could be that experiential, show you how it works kind of product that would go viral on a TikTok with short videos, with how-to videos.
[00:10:38] Brad Avery: I've been pretty curious as well, given that the way that the premium water bottle market has expanded and taken off, you know, all these sort of, you know, Yetis and other types of status symbol water bottles. It's been very beneficial for the powder drink space, you know, the single serve stick drinks. My favorite. When we All About sort of, you know, customizable beverages, which was something that PepsiCo talked about back in 2018 with Drinkfinity and consumers wanting to customize their drinks, the reusable aluminum water bottle is something that allows for that. You can buy different brands or you just have your water on The Good. And that space has taken off. I think the question then is, do consumers want to tie themselves to a single brand that has a very specific use case, you know, with a very specific type of water bottle? So what's the price point on this then? AirUp is $39.99 for the bottle plus a free pack included. And then it is $7.99 for each three pack of scent pods. They are designed to last for about one gallon of water or about three to four days. So you're talking about $7.99 a week, roughly a week and a half before you reorder, refill. That's sort of the system right now, it seems. Got it.
[00:11:57] Ray Latif: Well, just to get the last word on this, you know, I wouldn't be surprised if we do see Aerop take off. I also wouldn't be surprised if we see Aerop bottles at a yard sale a couple of years from now, and many of them have that. Bath & Beyond. Yeah, or Bath & Beyond. Well done, Jackie. Now, as Brad mentioned, AirUp is currently sold direct to consumer. Will it be sold at brick and mortar retailers in the near future? We don't know. Will it be sold at 7-Eleven in the near future? We don't know. But what we do know is that there will be a new class of products coming into 7-Eleven in the coming weeks and months. For the fourth year, 7-Eleven has introduced its Brands with Heart campaign, which, according to a story on BevNET, will enable brands to enter the C-Store channel by introducing their products to 7-Eleven, Speedway, and Stripes consumers nationwide. 7-Eleven is striving to quote, diversify its product offerings beyond the traditional C-store assortment. and put innovative products on the shelves that meet the needs of its on-the-go consumers. They haven't released the names of all the brands in this new cohort, but a bunch of them have already announced that they will be part of this program on LinkedIn, including Pulpo, Loco Sangria, Oza, Agua Bonita, Freestyle Snacks, Honey Bunchies, Chunk Nibbles, and Toasty. So congratulations to all those brands and the ones that have not announced their participation. This is pretty exciting stuff. Shauna Golden, our colleague who is on the editorial side, penned this article, which appeared on BevNET and Nosh. You should read the whole thing, especially if you're an early stage brand, because I'm sure you would love to get involved in this program as well. To do so, you need to be an insider. She actually used a quill and feather.
[00:13:45] Taste Radio: Did she use a quill and feather?
[00:13:47] Maxine Kozler: I saw her writing it. I'm trying to explain why people should be insiders, Mike. She wrote it on parchment paper, Ray.
[00:13:54] Ray Latif: I mean, that's just, that's the level we go to here. Okay. John Hancock. No, I mean, we mentioned this a lot on The Hot, but being an insider really does have a lot of benefits. And I think, you know, These kinds of stories go pretty deep into how these types of programs come together, why brands should apply, and the details that you'll need as you continue to scale and look for retailers to get involved with like a 7-Eleven. So I highly encourage you to become an insider. Pretty easy to do so. Go to BevNET.com slash insider. All the details are there. Another story recently written by our colleague Shauna Golden was about a brand called Suzy's. Suzy's is a New York-based brand of grain-free baked goods. They just entered their fifth year in business. I love this brand. I was first introduced to Suzy's via their sandwich bread, and I bought it in the freezer aisle when I was attempting to reduce my gluten intake. And I gotta tell you, I mean, just from a flavor standpoint, the bread is incredibly good tasting. It also is one of those types of products that doesn't make you feel full after you eat it. Typically bread just does that to you. And Susie's bread is so nutritious and so digestible. I'm not to get too TMI on this, but you can just tell it's good for you and great tasting. And I mean, that's pretty much all you want out of anything you eat.
[00:15:13] Maxine Kozler: I just like it that a muffin is a muffin and a donut is a donut. And the founder is so kind too. She's really great. She's a great listener. She makes great products. I mean, All About just perfect person to found this company.
[00:15:28] New Orleans: Yeah, and she's been to Nosh Live and I remember them just getting started and reading this article. At their five-year mark, it's really cool to see how the Brad Has evolved and how they went from the freezer aisle to now having shelf-stable products, how they were really going all An On grain-free and now it's more of a better-for-you, nutritious product line. So it's cool to learn how they've evolved over the years. And it's a great case study for other brands, I think, as they grow to learn just how you can pivot and how you can change your messaging and go into different parts of the store.
[00:16:04] Ray Latif: Well, talking about Susie's, we can't not All About this new line of birthday cake doughnuts, this new product of birthday cake doughnuts, that is, made with almond flour and coconut oil, two grams of protein per doughnut, nine grams of sugar. They're gluten-free, they have natural sprinkles, and they're low in sugar. I have this box in my hand, I'm going to open this up right now. Don't worry, it's been defrosted. They Tasty Treats frozen, Ray.
[00:16:29] Maxine Kozler: I tried them frozen and heated up, and
[00:16:33] Taste Radio: You don't need to even thaw them. Okay, well, this is mostly thawed, so. Oh, that's really tasty. It's a mukbang now. It's a mukbang?
[00:16:46] Maxine Kozler: Yeah, it's a mukbang. What's that? When someone watches you eat and you talk a little bit.
[00:16:51] Taste Radio: Yeah.
[00:16:52] Maxine Kozler: But you have to eat like copious amounts. You have to eat the whole box of donuts for it to be a mukbang.
[00:16:57] Brad Avery: We've been needing more tasting on Taste Radio.
[00:16:59] Taste Radio: Yeah.
[00:17:00] Ray Latif: Yeah. Their birthday cake doughnuts and their double chocolate doughnuts are now available nationwide at Sprouts. That was part of the news that they announced when they were announcing their birthday cake flavor doughnuts. And just seems like all things are going right for Suzy's at this point. Excited to see where this Brandt Gehrs in the future. Seems like we do need to get Suzy herself on Taste Radio for an interview, that is, sometime in the near future. Do it. Mike just got really excited.
[00:17:27] Taste Radio: Definitely. Can't wait to hear that one. Yes.
[00:17:32] Ray Latif: In terms of other new products that have crossed our desks over the past week, I think I mentioned this, I don't think I mentioned this, I definitely mentioned this from Expo West when Tia Lupita launched their salsa matcha products. This is a two-skew line of really traditional salsa, which is mostly oil-based and also contains Lots of seeds. The two that I'm holding in my hand, one has chilies, peanuts, and pepitas. The other one has chilies, cranberries, and pepitas. Again, this is not the kind of salsa that most people are used to, which is made with fresh ingredients like tomatoes, onions, and peppers. This is, again, oil-based. and my mouth is watering, sorry, olive oil base in particular. And you can scoop it with a tortilla chip, just like you would salsa you know, or the salsa most people know. But this is extraordinarily flavorful and gives a mouthfeel that is a little crunchy, a little savory, a little bit sweet. It's phenomenal. So well done, Tia Lupita.
[00:18:34] Maxine Kozler: Speaking of olive oil, I have the new Boathouse Coffee Granola Butter. And when I found out that they had coffee, I was like, this Futurama reference will mostly be for Brad. But I heard the Hypnotoad sound in my mind. Maybe Joe can pull The Ground. And I was just like, I got to have that. And it's here. So I mean, I can't wait to try it. Coffee, granola, butter, come on. What will they think of next?
[00:19:03] Brad Avery: You know, it may be a little outside of the Nosh realm, but I did try The Hot ones Pringles that I think Jackie, you were also sampling. that I'm a big fan. I mean, Hot Ones is a little more closer, so there is that brand tie-in, but I really enjoyed it. I thought it was actually legitimately spicy, but a real quality spice to it. I really thought that... I only tried the Verde, and it was manageable. It was bearable. It wasn't like, oh God, I'm dying, but it was like, oh, minutes later, I'm still feeling that spice. I can only have a handful. I'm waiting for The Good crisp version to come out.
[00:19:43] SPEAKER_??: No.
[00:19:44] New Orleans: They should.
[00:19:45] Maxine Kozler: They should, but nothing wrong with a little indulgence. Pringles are a guilty pleasure of mine. Those are quality product Pringles.
[00:19:52] New Orleans: I tried the Rojo version, which that's very spicy. And it's actually a fun party trick because you just see who can handle as many Pringles as possible. And they usually get one or two bites into those ones and they give up.
[00:20:07] Brad Avery: What was the company that did that? It was like the chip or something. And it was like it was a single chip package that was just deathly spicy. And like people thought like, oh, it's a joke. And people would take it and they'd be like, oh, no, I'm out. Oh, my God. PAQ.
[00:20:25] New Orleans: The one chip challenge.
[00:20:26] Ray Latif: I would try that. I don't think you wouldn't want to try that, Brad. I've seen terrible, terrible stories.
[00:20:32] Maxine Kozler: Before the one-chip challenge, don't do the one-chip challenge. And if you need further advice on this, ask John McKenna, our head of sales.
[00:20:42] Brad Avery: See, I'm the type of person, I watch Hot Ones and I'm like, I want to do that. I want to just take that challenge.
[00:20:48] Maxine Kozler: I want that pain. If you want to go next level, just like the Pocky ghost pepper chips. They're not like, the Trader Joe's ghost pepper chip is probably my favorite potato chip in the world. Those are really good. Those are so tasty, but they're not really that ghost peppery. The Pocky, yeah, look the same. It's one of those things where it looks the same and you think it's gonna be the same. And then when you eat the Pocky, the Pocky is legit. And I've told the story on The Hot before, but for new listeners, My very first Expo West, I tried the Pocky chips, and then I went to the restroom, and I didn't wash my hands as well.
[00:21:32] Taste Radio: Oh, no. End of story.
[00:21:37] Brad Avery: Wait, what? The screams could be heard all the way from Hall A to Hall H. That's pretty much what was happening. I should have washed before, and then also after. You know what though? All I've heard from this conversation is I should try the Oneship Challenge.
[00:21:55] Maxine Kozler: Brad, if you do, do it on The Hot. Yes, exactly. No, let's have him back on The Hot or we'll do an Instagram or something. We have to, we got to gram it, come to the office.
[00:22:07] Ray Latif: If we do it, if we do it on The Hot, we've got to do a live show. That's number one. And number two, you've got to do it so that you can't drink any liquids within 60 seconds. First, I don't think we should wait that long.
[00:22:19] Maxine Kozler: We should do this as a reel on BevNET. That's what we're doing. Yeah, okay. All right. We're gonna have to do at the end of the workday. We're gonna have to do this at like 530.
[00:22:28] Brad Avery: We've articulated how we're gonna torture Brad.
[00:22:30] Maxine Kozler: Yeah. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no We just want to film this. That's all.
[00:22:47] Ray Latif: OK, the last thing on this I'll say is, Brad, you should just watch other people doing it on YouTube. I've shacked it in an episode of Inside the NBA, and you can see what would happen to him. So I'll just say that. All right, moving right along. Calling out another brand that's been doing some amazing things over the past few years, Simple Mills. Simple Mills recently introduced a new line of nut butter stuffed sandwich cookies. These are Oreo-ish, but they're made with nut butters. I'm holding in my hand their creamy peanut butter variety, which also contains cashew butter. Caitlin Smith and her team at Simple Mills have been killing it over the past few years. And I mean, I'm just amazed by everything they put out. It's just so flavorful and yet made with very high quality premium natural organic ingredients and just really filling that void or that what had been a void in the center store when it comes to cracker, better for you crackers, better for you cookies, mixes, things like that. So still on this incredible runway of growth and success for Simple Mills. We got to get Caitlin back on the podcast now that I think about it.
[00:23:51] New Orleans: Bringing it back to, so I have a beverage and it landed in the San Diego office yesterday, I believe. It's called Inura. So it's a line of teas and lemonades that are beverages without sacrifice. And The Maxi call-outs are really low-cal and low-sugar and keto-friendly. So this is the packaging. One thing I'd say, there's just a lot going on, so it's hard to tell right away that it's a tea or a lemonade.
[00:24:19] Maxine Kozler: Yeah. It's a pretty interesting package.
[00:24:22] New Orleans: Yeah. But definitely trying with the keto play and the low sugar. It looks like they have their own Inura sweet that it's sweetened with, but I don't see any functional element to it. So I'm curious just how they'll do.
[00:24:35] Maxine Kozler: I think the branding is really cool, but it definitely needs to be clear about what it is or at least what the flavor is, because those are the things that pull you in.
[00:24:45] New Orleans: Yeah. And even looking at like the lemonade next to the mango peach tea, like the flavor call-outs, you can't really tell which one's which. There's like a small little lemon and a small little mango peach. But I think with a couple like branding tweaks, packaging tweaks, then they could visually depict that a little bit better.
[00:25:02] Maxine Kozler: How does it taste?
[00:25:04] New Orleans: I haven't tried it yet. Let's go.
[00:25:06] Maxine Kozler: Go for it, Jackie.
[00:25:06] New Orleans: Come on. Eating and drinking. It's pretty good. Yeah. I mean, I think their main thing is that you don't get that like, aftertaste. So yeah, it is a little bit sweet, but not too sweet. Tastes like an iced tea to me.
[00:25:22] Ray Latif: What's the sweetener? It's that Inura... Inura Sweet. ...proprietary blend of sweeteners. Is that what you're saying, right?
[00:25:29] New Orleans: Yeah. It looks like it's like monk fruit, erythritol, stevia, like a mix.
[00:25:34] SPEAKER_??: Cool.
[00:25:34] Ray Latif: Yes. The Beverage Whisperer himself dropped by the office over the past week and we shared some manure with him, got his thoughts on those beverages and many more. Always good to see Kenny S, you know? Kenny S. He's a wealth of information. He's fun to have a drink with, whether it's non-alcoholic or alcoholic. And yeah, it was fun taking his pulse on some of the beverages that have been in the office. But he also was great because he introduced us to Vitacoco's new products. They have a new hydration drink mix blend. It's sold exclusively at Costco. So yeah, interesting stuff for sure.
[00:26:11] Maxine Kozler: Yeah, I'm looking forward to trying that. Ken left some behind, so that one is on my list of things to try.
[00:26:17] New Orleans: And now bringing it back to the beginning of this episode, I found there is a Beignet beer and I would love to try it. Who makes it? I knew it.
[00:26:26] Brad Avery: I knew it.
[00:26:27] New Orleans: Yeah, it's from a Foul Board Brewing and it's beignet a lot. So it's like a coffee beignet flavor profile.
[00:26:35] Maxine Kozler: We gotta slide into their DMs, Jackie.
[00:26:37] New Orleans: Huh?
[00:26:38] Maxine Kozler: We gotta slide into their DMs.
[00:26:39] New Orleans: I'm definitely sliding into their DMs.
[00:26:46] Ray Latif: Alright, as I mentioned at the top of The Hot, I have been in New Orleans over the past week and taking part in the convention known as Tales of The Cocktail, an annual gathering in which thousands of hospitality and spirit industry professionals descend upon the city known as the Big Easy. This was the 20th edition of The Hot, which had been on hiatus for two years due to the COVID-19 pandemic. Tales, a common nickname for the event, is primarily held at the Ritz-Carlton, where a slew of seminars, tasting panels, and networking sessions occupy the first three floors of The Hot, located in the city's historic French Quarter. Amid crowds of bustling and joyous attendees at every turn, the convention featured dozens of multinational and independent brands, many of which highlighted new and limited-edition products. Significantly, Tails offered key insights The Cocktail and beverage alcohol trends and how brands are attempting to win over on- and off-premise consumers. Notable takeaways included a continued emphasis on premium brands and ingredients, low and no-ABV cocktails, and ethnic spirits easing their way onto barbacks and liquor store shelves. On the latter point, I was fortunate to sit down with leaders and representatives from Italicus, an Italian aperitivo made with bergamot and other botanicals, and Ichiko Sochu, a barley-based spirit that is The Hot consumed beverage alcohol in Japan. Both brands have made consistent inroads among spirit retailers and influential bars in the U.S., and while educating consumers on use case and occasion is perhaps The Hot pressing challenge, each remains bullish about their prospects given rising consumer demand for cultural and innovative spirits. Meanwhile, ready-to-drink and ready-to-pour cocktails were a common sight at Tails. In most cases, their presence was a factor of convenience and portability, as was the case when I visited Campari's hospitality suite at the Virgin Hotel, where I encountered a yet-to-be-released canned Campari spritz and a ready-to-drink wild The Cocktail. Craft The Cocktail, which helped pioneer the category when it launched in 2013, is now available nationally on Amtrak Dining Cars, according to co-founder Charles Jolie, whom I spoke with for an interview that will be featuring in an upcoming episode of the podcast. Spirits conglomerate William Grant & Sons showcased their recently launched Batch Bottle, a brand of ready-to-pour, super-premium cocktails that are made with company-owned brands including Hendrix Gin, Monkey Shoulder, and Sailor Jerry, and packaged in 375ml bottles. Despite traction for premixed cocktails, there remains some skepticism about the quality of the products as compared to those prepared and served on-premise. And in a clear sign of the times, the second floor on the Ritz featured a low and no bar that highlighted a rotating selection of low ABV and non-alcoholic spirits and innovative mixtures. From my perspective, the bar was a refreshing option for attendees whose non-alcoholic beverage options were mostly limited to Perrier and bottled water. Outside of the event, the demand for lower and zero-alcohol cocktails is surging, according to several industry professionals that I spoke with. Much more from this incredible event coming to Taste Radio in the form of interviews that I recorded over the past week. Stay tuned for conversations with the co-founders of Nelson's Greenbrier Distillery, Johnnie Walker's Master Blender, and as mentioned, Charles Jolie. Alright, it's time to get to the latest edition of the Maxi-Minutes, our regular series in which we sit down with LDR Ventures co-founder Maxine Kozler. In this conversation, Maxine discussed effective ways for brands to achieve a high rate of sell-through, tips on aligning with merchandising and demo agencies, and the value of having experienced industry professionals on your team, especially when courting investors. All right, we're back with Maxine Kozler for another edition of The Maxi Minutes. Maxi, so great to hear from you once again.
[00:31:17] The Cocktail: Hi, Ray. Always a pleasure to be here.
[00:31:20] Ray Latif: Definitely. Missed you in New York for BevNET Live and Nosh Live, but you're back in the Big All About a week or two later for a monster event called NFT NYC. From what I understand, it was enormous.
[00:31:36] The Cocktail: Absolutely right, yes. I was sorry to miss BevNET and Nosh and I'll probably be there next year. But yes, I was coming the following week to NFT NYC, which was huge. It was a really amazing, fun event throughout the whole city. Exciting, young, fresh, cutting-edge projects. with great industry Report From established. We did a pop up event with Shopify and worked with some other really big platforms that are totally supporting the Web3 NFT world.
[00:32:09] Ray Latif: Well, as we've discussed, it's really important to keep an eye for entrepreneurs to keep an eye on what's happening in the NFT and Web3 space. However, there's a lot that they need to consider as it relates to getting into retailers and getting sell-through. And this is a topic that is often discussed among entrepreneurs on Taste Radio, which is When you get into a store, when you get into a retail chain, how do you best support the brand on shelf? And I know you have some thoughts on that, Maxie.
[00:32:41] The Cocktail: Yeah, I feel really passionate about this topic with our companies we're invested in and working with and even just as the pitch decks come in. I've been really thinking about how to best advise our founders on this. And they get really super excited when they get picked up by buyers and they're going into whether it's a Whole Foods or an Air One. I know a lot of people have been getting into great key accounts in Texas that have been new and hot and exciting. But more and more my thoughts about this is I like slow and methodical. We've talked about it. I'm more of a patient investor. I want my brands to own their region. I want them to really thoughtfully go into a region, whether that's through one big account or a couple medium-sized accounts, get in the stores, understand the customers, and get sell-through. I would rather see those stats than The Hot into 7,000 or 8,000 stores nationally. I want them to understand who their customer is, what that customer is looking for, how to sell to them over and over again. and really build that relationship with the retailer before they pull on to bigger, bigger accounts and stores. A key, key piece of this is the merchandising team, whether it's internal or an external firm you get. and the demo team or the demo agency that you employ. And learning how to manage those things, because just learning how to manage outside agencies that you work with is also such a key thing. So trying it at a smaller level is always going to be easier to figure it out than trying to blow out a big national campaign. But in terms of use of funds when we're investing, I would much rather hear that someone's going to own their region, a state or a territory, and that they're gonna use their funds not only to get in the stores, but to make sure they're selling in the stores, as opposed to immediately having to open up like a second DC on the East Coast or the West Coast, because now they're going national. I'd rather see the funds go to merchandising and demoing to make sure that they build a really loyal customer base and just not available everywhere, but who knows if they're gonna sell or not.
[00:35:04] Ray Latif: Merchandising and demoing are really important. They can also be really expensive. And I guess this speaks to the question of being well capitalized at the outset. How much of working capital should go toward merchandising and demo strategies? I don't know if there's a specific answer you have for that, but is it more than people think?
[00:35:27] The Cocktail: I feel like I would love to see it not in the marketing budget, but in the sales budget. Immediately in your sales budget, you've got to put your discounts that the store is going to require you to go on sale periodically. Sometimes they want end cap money and banner money and things like that. I'd rather see a line item in your sales budget. that could be $0.50 or $1 out of every product sale is for your demo and merchandising budget. Because then that's like the true cost of what it is to sell that product.
[00:36:03] Ray Latif: It can also be kind of tricky to navigate the merchandising and demo world, I guess. You know, there's a lot of agencies out there that claim to be able to, you know, effectively support and optimize those strategies. Do you have any, I guess, guidance or advice on how to pick the right partner?
[00:36:24] The Cocktail: The Maxi network that I see is the founders Tales of The other founders. And I keep a list myself of digital marketing agencies, PR agencies, demo companies, merchandisers that all of our founders are using. And the founders, for The Hot part, are pretty honest about what kind of experience they had with them. And sometimes they can say they're great but we just weren't big enough and didn't get enough attention, or we realized we had to have someone in house who really managed that relationship on a daily basis we couldn't just give them instructions and say go, you know, give us a weekly report. So I always talk to other founders. asked for recommendations and asked for an honest review on how it was to actually work with them. The other thing is we talked to someone recently where we said to them, you know, we're really interested in working with you. Do you have the bandwidth for us? Honestly, can you tell us if you have the bandwidth? And they very honestly said, like, we have a big bandwidth problem. And we can't hire people fast enough. So yeah, like this is how we're solving it. And this is the attention you will get. But no, we have a bandwidth problem. And I was so grateful that they were honest about it. And eventually we did decide not to work with them, which was the right move, because we would have been so frustrated had we signed the deal and The Hot no attention.
[00:37:43] Ray Latif: It's definitely helpful if you have people who are experienced in working with outside agencies, you know, that experience can be extremely helpful for a founder who is relatively new to The Good or beverage industry. And that's me talking, but, you know, as an investor, how much weight do you give to a company that has folks that are highly experienced whether it be in sales, marketing, operations, finance, does that really move the needle for you in any particular way?
[00:38:17] The Cocktail: 100 percent. That will make or break these days what we're going to invest into early stage first time founders younger founders. We love their vision their experience their perspective. You know they don't they don't have a lot of binds around what they think they can do which is beautiful and wonderful and needed. What I find is if they, whether it's really active daily advisors or bringing a co-founder on or a partner on who's involved on a daily basis, who is much more experienced in that specific industry is what we're looking for. Because what I'm seeing is although the founders have great vision and they even have an understanding of their particular market, A lot of time and a lot of money is not efficiently being used because they're figuring everything out for the first time.
[00:39:16] Ray Latif: How do you help people find experienced operators in the industry? How do you help them vet the right people for their companies?
[00:39:25] The Cocktail: We always wanna help out with vetting candidates. If someone's gonna make a big hire, they're gonna bring that VP of sales in, because that's the first big hire they need, or a CMO. We always tell them, please let us help you interview them. We wanna, in whatever way, just give our feedback, given our experience in hiring people time over time. So we like to do that. And then, yeah, we'll make recommendations. And I love, you know, when we get an investor newsletter, whether it's monthly or quarterly, and at the bottom, it says, here are the roles we're hiring, please send us recommendations. And if we have someone, we will always send a recommendation.
[00:40:04] Ray Latif: Do you get offended if the entrepreneur asks you not to be involved in that process? Or is that a red flag? Or is it just one of those things where you just kind of Accepted The feelings on that subject?
[00:40:17] The Cocktail: It's becoming much more of a red flag. It really is. If we have a resume personally that is in a specific area that we want to at least just weigh in for them about, if it's something that's not our expertise, we don't try and, you know, step our toe in. But if something we really know, and we say, hey, listen, we just want to give you our feedback on this, and they don't accept it. And sometimes it is just a bandwidth thing, like they're consulting one or two people. They don't have the bandwidth to consult like four different investors or advisors. I understand that. Unfortunately, we're seeing a lot of the repercussions of early and young founders not taking advantage of the deep experience of their investors.
[00:41:04] Ray Latif: Well, there you have it. Entrepreneurs listening. Listen to your investors. They have your best interests at heart. At least most of them do, I would think. Maxie certainly does. And I know Maxie, you're probably still recovering from that long week in New York City. And I really appreciate you taking the time to sit down with me today, as does our audience, every time that we do this. Thank you so much once again.
[00:41:27] The Cocktail: Now, thank you, Ray. I really appreciate it. And it was a very inspiring week. There is unbelievable creativity and utility is the big word around NFTs and just how you can engage people in a brand. It was super exciting to be in that kind of atmosphere.
[00:41:44] Ray Latif: Fantastic. Well, again, listeners, I'm sure a lot of you still have questions and are a little, I guess, curious, but cautious about that NFT Web3 space. Maxie's here to help. So reach out to her and she will give you the lowdown on what you need to know.
[00:42:01] The Cocktail: Thank you, Ray.
[00:42:02] Ray Latif: Once again, Maxie, thank you so much for taking the time today. And I'll see you next time for the next edition of The Maxi Minutes. All right, that brings us to the end of this episode of Taste Radio. Thank you so much for listening, and thanks to our guest, Maxine Kozler. As always, for questions, comments, ideas for future podcasts, please send us an email to askatasteradio.com. On behalf of the entire Taste Radio team, thank you for listening, and we'll talk to you next time.
